636:) to behave unpredictably and fail, as these are not designed for the difficult compensation for the high latency connections. As research has repeatedly demonstrated that perceived delays in answering questions subconsciously suggests doubt to the listener and can generate mistrust even when both sides are aware of the lag , geostationary connections are best avoided for important voice calls. Other research into interactive systems has repeatedly demonstrated that latency lag is the most debilitating and irritating of all interactive system flaws and often gives an extremely negative impression of the system or its usefulness. Some researchers have gone so far as to recommend simply refusing connections to those with latency likely to result in poor interactive user experience.
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simple it is and fixed it? Hmmm, maybe because they just aren't as smart as me! Next on my to do list: the problems of famine, war, and republicans..." Saying adding a robust and well-designed cache to a satellite is practical is rather silly: anything in a satellite had better be robust and well-designed. I assume the editor means well-designed in terms of what it caches: doing that alone would, I assume, be impractical because the algorithm which determined what to cache would have an impossible task due to the range of information required. Of course, I know next to nothing about this topic, so I didn't remove the text, just cleaned it up and flagged it. I suspect, however, that the editor who added it knew no more than I, hence the overreaching claims of practicality. --
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the sender that it should keep sending data. IETF RFC 2488 mostly writes about adding additional features to the TCP -- e.g. additions to the
Congestion Control Algorithm to implement Fast Retransmit and Fast Recovery...or the addition of large windows, window scaling, the Selective Acknowledgement (SACK) option, etc. More of the gory details about these extensions can be found in IETF RFC 1323 (TCP Extensions for High Performance) and IETF RFC 2001 (TCP Slow Start, Congestion Avoidance, Fast Retransmit, and Fast Recovery Algorithms).
485:(This is a misunderstanding of geosynchronous orbit. Geosynchronous orbit means that the satellite stays in the same place over the Earth, because it's orbit is synchronous with the Earth's rotation. Both rotate every 24 hours, so the effect as seen from the ground is that the satellite never moves. Thus it's very easy for people on the Earth to point a dish at it and communicate with it. It's why geosynchrous satellites are generally preferred over lower orbit satellites.)
644:(which typically involve several round trips using layered protocols) which are almost universally unusable through geostationary connections. Typical VPN connections made over satellite will be at least double (and often, with poor protocols and misguided security measures) quadruple or worse the underlying basic latency. . Unless the VPN is literally re-engineered to accommodate high-latency users, it will be useless for anything but email, download and a static web.
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topic that should be linked to but it must be made clear that no interactive application can benefit from it. Presently the introductory section focuses on the problems of high latency and only claims "geostationary" systems are useless for these. Perhaps we can debate the adjectives used, and find the most credible citations (the research is in
1246:. I didn't find any external coverage, despite the first website claiming to have been mentioned in several newspapers, but maybe that is just an issue with my search. Based on the whitepaper they want to launch the first satellite in Q1 2020, a schedule that seems extremely optimistic given the lack of anything visible. --
593:" or something because geostationary satellite is not the only high-latency connection out there. Anyone ever try to "tether" a "smartphone" via a nonstandard USB connection? Most of these things have no Ethernet ports leaving you relying on proprietary drivers and very flaky proprietary ware. Tethering an
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It looks like this user is trying to remove any article content that may cast satellite internet services in a bad light, such as anything that suggests the service can be slow or high latency. The editor apparently doesn't care if the article material is cited or is now historical... the content is
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Performance
Enhancing Proxies (PEP) seem to be well-supported. Cisco routers support this in their IOS software as of version 12.3T, it is called "Rate Based Satellite Control Protocol". The PEP technique is also referred to as "TCP spoofing" since it involves the injection of TCP ACKs to convince
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Overall I think this article is pretty negative towards GEO, and pretty positive for MEO/LEO. I would suggest to make the article more neutral towards GEO, and add the negative aspects of MEO/LEO as well (higher costs because of tracking antenna's, less obvious to be used for VSAT consumer type of
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It looks like en masse" satellite downbeams do not encrypt the material, so that only the requesting individual could access the content of the received package. Therefore downloading a family video via satellite could expose the toddler to kidnappers or a teenage girl to online perverts, etc. This
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With regard to reducing latency, there are a number of mechanisms available for reducing the *effects* of latency on
Internet protocols such as TCP. These mechanisms don't reduce the actual physical latency but mitigate the problems caused by the huge latency incurred in satellite links. The most
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After cost, this is the most important question in the minds of most readers: Is satellite going to have unacceptable latency for my application? Definitely the section on "reducing latency" is garbage simply because you don't reduce the latency, you compensate for it. Cacheing is another whole
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satellite. I'm wondering how that satellite works... I noticed it's got a geosynchronous orbit... so it would pass the same spot in the sky every certain time (in this case 24 hours). How are people on the ground supposed to communicate with it?. And will it later on be a web of satellites so that
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The reducing latency section appears to be one person's original research. Caching is impractical for a huge range of uses. It all depends on the usage pattern of the users. This section reads to me like "Look everyone, I've solved this huge problem so simply, why haven't the experts realized how
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It seems as if it is written by somebody who has business interest in MEO of LEO has been editing this article. The majority of all internet links over satellite for IP trunking, backbone and internet access are over GEO satellites, and I know from my personal experience that VoIP, Skype, etc...
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Yes, and bringing family photos to a public place to print them exposes everyone visible to kidnappers and perverts who work for Wal-Mart. This is not worth space in this article. However, a table of encryption and privacy polices would be helpful so people could see which providers took *any*
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The page also needs to be qualified as 'home' or 'consumer grade' satellite internet access. There are many definitive and interesting applications of modem and modulation technologies that apply to professional or government 'ad hoc' networks that are not currently used in commercial systems
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The functionality of live interactive access to a distant computer can also be subject to the problems caused by high latency. However these problems are more than tolerable for basic email access and web browsing, and in most cases are barely noticeable. This is not true, however, for
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Self orienting systems ie include the Oyster CI Skew
Internet (3500 €), these are hence much more costly than non-self orienting systems (about 500 €) Tracking systems (allowing continuous orientation, ie for use on ships) also exist but are rare and very expensive. include in article
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Maybe the latency can be brought below the 1000 to 1500 milliseconds some people have regularly experienced with WildBlue and others, but less than 480 msec (citing RFC 2488) for bidirectional geostationary satellite
Internet is physically impossible due to the speed of
389:"... It's not clear, like a marketer's one-liner as this sentence could sound like the VSAT transceiver is directly receiving its data from the satellite... There's simply no such thing as "via the satellite" for end-users, everything goes through the Gateways. --
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Once the initial request has been processed by the gateway’s servers, sent to and returned from the
Internet, the requested information is sent back as a forward or downstream payload to the end-user via the satellite, which directs the signal to the subscriber
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Several companies plan to launch constellations, many increase their planned size. Unfortunately it's not a good reference and the primary reference is not the best source either (while it is reliable: it's a technical primary source).
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Also, if receive-only satellite internet is obsolete as you say, then label the section as historical but leave it in the article. It would be useful to cite which companies once offered it, and when the service was phased
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I put a picture of the Wild Blue dish that we have installed on our home up on the article. One of these days if I remember I'll take a picture of the satellite modem and put it up on this article too.
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I was looking for a list of companies that offer satellite internet access to consumers. I expected to find it here. I didn't. At least it could have pointed me to such a list somewhere else.
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The infobox does, with one exception, not cite its sources. Claims such as about the "average" bandwidth are highly dubious, especially without explanation how such an average is determined. --
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A so short section may be absorbed within the ramaing WP article. In anu case, it provides two academic footnotes for an article that results to be poorly sourced since
January 2019. Regards.
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can yield latencies that vary wildly from 600 to 6000 ms! Windows XP Pro does somewhat better in my experience, more like 230 to 900ms, but it is still not usable for anything interactive.
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marketed to the public for a variety of practical reasons. This page refers mainly to consumer systems, and ignores significant advances using broadcast and military grade equipment.
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works without problematic delay. However, real time games, remote surgery, etc... who are very time critical do not work well over satellite, which is common knowledge.
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Definitely these should be mentioned but make sure to link every single IETF standard and technical acronym (to the actual term you mean, not just "IOS" or "SACK".
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I tried to give some mention of the satellite in the
Satellites launched section. I also referenced it to the other "WINDS" Knowledge article. -- (
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measures to protect their browsing or not. In condos who cares what porn your neighbors watch, you can hear them through the walls anyway.
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I do not understand why the use of GEO satellites for internet connectivity is so much negatively depicted throughout this whole article.
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looks like even nastier than cable TV net, where whole condos sometime share the same circuit and you can sniff the neighbours's traffic.
1318:- a thousand times more in a typical 200 €/month family consumer package for mobile phone, landbased phone, TV and internet! Sincerely,
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A statement should be made at the top to redirect to more relevant information if 'non-consumer grade' internet is being researched.
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This inherent latency makes
Satellite Internet service essentially unusable for applications requiring real-time user input, such as
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It needs to include information about iPSTAR, listed elsewhere in
Knowledge, the worlds first pure IP satellite, and most efficient
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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I added a small section in the history section, but the article structure makes it challenging to edit it consistently. --
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Just trying to get relevant, accurate and fresh information on this page. Any guidance on how to do it properly welcome
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The geostationary latency issues are not obsolete or irrelevant. The latency of geostationary cannot be eliminated.
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The structure of this page is horrible, with redundant information and forward references all over the place.
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Much of the information presented about satellite ground station and antenna architecture is inaccurate.
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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632:, or other person to person communication. It will cause most general market applications (such as
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https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/new-fcc-processing-round-prompts-license-requests-frhr-von-der-ropp/
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https://web.archive.org/web/20121017002043/http://www.darpa.mil/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=1800
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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and other credible sources, relatively easy to find, no "OR"). We may also need a new article "
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IETF RFC 3135 - Performance Enhancing Proxies Intended to Mitigate Link-Related Degradations
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cf "Using such a modem is extremely expensive—data transfer costs between $ 5 and $ 7 per
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1265:. I used "SpaceNet" as keyword in my searches but that seems to be a more recent name. --
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10 years after it's still very bad. For example, in the Gateways section, it's written: "
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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IETF RFC 2488 - Enhancing TCP Over Satellite Channels using Standard Mechanisms
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The page needs to include definition / links on latency and round-trip delays.
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It only mentions a few, i can't believe those are the only ones up there... --
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alternatives to increasing performance without actually reducing latency
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Alex Miller is a content writer for ViaSat Inc. in Englewood, Colorado.
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An editor has reviewed this edit and fixed any errors that were found.
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Expanded on the section some with the launch of the WINDS satellite. (
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Knowledge does not delete article content for obsolete technologies.
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List of companies that offer satellite internet access to consumers
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This has been removed from the latest version of their user page.
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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101:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the
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important references I have found on this topic are:
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613:Geostationary useless for low-latency applications
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786:"Satellites launched" section is too restricted
1201:Satellite Internet Characteristics -- Sources?
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1121:I have just modified one external link on
565:Is reducing latency section nearly all OR?
640:character-by-character command shell or
493:) 22:56, December 2, 2009 - Dave Berg)
220:Knowledge:WikiProject Telecommunications
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223:Template:WikiProject Telecommunications
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591:latency effect on online applications
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805:More neutrality on GEO vs MEO needed
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1376:In oceonography and in seismology
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1345:Allain, Rhett (2011-06-21).
1306:Cost / MegaByte or GigaByte?
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226:Telecommunications articles
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1118:Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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817:internet access, etc...)
779:) 11:25, October 28, 2010
732:) 11:25, October 28, 2010
674:) 11:25, October 28, 2010
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195:Telecommunication portal
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899:On September 4, 2012,
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40:WikiProjects
1013:Vacuum tube
949:Alex Miller
769:74.198.15.1
722:74.198.15.1
664:74.198.15.1
545:—Preceding
521:—Preceding
1387:Categories
1363:2020-06-13
1333:References
1240:Whitepaper
1191:Report bug
1073:with Apple
1025:Buggy whip
792:TiagoTiago
700:ChrisTracy
355:Inaccurate
1358:1059-1028
1320:SvenAERTS
1174:this tool
1167:this tool
336:Cborgcbtv
1316:Gigabyte
1312:megabyte
1228:Spacenet
1180:Cheers.—
1041:DMahalko
1017:Linotype
977:DMahalko
939:Talex101
924:DMahalko
887:contribs
875:unsigned
847:unsigned
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391:HawkFest
387:terminal
376:contribs
364:unsigned
344:contribs
332:unsigned
316:contribs
304:unsigned
285:contribs
273:unsigned
112:Internet
103:Internet
59:Internet
1232:Website
1127:my edit
523:undated
405:Picture
244:on the
139:on the
30:B-class
1207:Tobias
1077:OneWeb
1069:Boeing
1065:SpaceX
966:light.
595:iPhone
587:SIGCHI
539:iPSTAR
412:JesseG
36:scale.
1351:Wired
634:Skype
457:WINDS
451:WINDS
1355:ISSN
1324:talk
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668:talk
626:VoIP
599:OS/X
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