Talk:Ivan the Terrible

2174:

early modern periods are guesses, as there aren't very good records. There was no census and the land cadastres (pistsovye knigi) are incomplete). Ruslan Skryinnikov argued that perhaps only about 6,000 were killed, based on prayer lists the tsar sent to the Kirillov Monastery and Skryatov, but those may be only the most important people (boyars, middle-servicemen, clergymen) and not the peasantry; The figure of 60,000 is from German accounts at the time. No one really understands why Ivan implemented the Oprichnina. There is the argument that it was to suppress the boyars, but then a lot of boyars were in the Oprichnina and most of the victims appear to be peasants. Skrynnikov, Zimin, and others who have studied it aren't really sure why Ivan implemented it, so it very well might be Ivan's paranoia. There was an article a few years back that argued Ivan was just another renaissance prince (I believe it was by Michael Cherniavsky, but I don't know how well that claim has been accepted. Ivan liked to thow animals off of towers, he scalded peasants with hot wine when they came to petition him, and he found ways to kill people beyond the normal execution of traitors and criminals - he is reported to have sewn Archbishop Pimen of Novgorod up in a bearskin and set dogs on him. It seems there were some mental problems, if not paranoia, something else. When his sarcophagus was opened in the Soviet period, his spine was fused and it is thought that may have put pressure on the spinal column and caused nervous or mental disorders. So it seems it was more than the harsh realities of rule in the sixteenth century that made Ivan do what he did. --

878: 4136:

known as brandishing) is a violent crime in most state jurisdictions of the United States. Although the wording and degrees of offense vary slightly from state to state, the criminal act of menacing generally consists of displaying a weapon to a person with the intention of threatening them with bodily harm from said weapon. - это близкое по значению определение!)) Поясняю еще раз, это не значит что он был страшным или уродливым или пугающим, это значит что один его вид грозил всем окружающим и вселял в сердца страх перед Царем, который был 180 см роста, имел атлетическое сложение, это значит что по тем временам он был великаном, был умен и суров! Смотрите реконструкцию Mikhail Gerasimov! Grozny - означает выражение его лица, содержащее в себе угрозу, грозный взгляд.

1932:"In a dispute with Novgorod Republic, Ivan ordered the Oprichniks to murder the inhabitants of this city. Between thirty and forty thousand were killed. Yet the official death toll named 1,500 of Novgorod big people (nobility) and only mentioned about the same number of smaller people." -- It is not fact-based. First of all, "murder of inhabitants" needs to be re-worded. I was not the exact mission. 30-40 thousand is way too high. Estimates at Novgorod population of this time are about 20-30 thousand total and number of victims 2-3 thousand of which nobility stands at few hundred. Can someone double check this with reputable source (Skrynnikov?)? 1561:

ridiculous given that Ivan was only three. When he was three he didn't rule - regents did. He formally came to the throne when he came of age and a regency was no longer needed. The sentence talks about him being three and being dominated by his mother. This makes the sentence ridiculous even without any historical context. His mother died when he was eight so it's fairly redundant to say that his minority was dominated by her. You talk about adults being dominated by their mother, not fatherless children. Also, she was only alive for half his minority, so she couldn't have dominated his minority that much.

1700:

upbringing of little Ivan Vasilyevich. Since he left early without parents, Vasili III and Elenа, grandma Anna Jakšić of Serbia she took care of her grandson, it is certain, she met with the Serbian tradition." What I find highly irritating is that the contributor, surely a Serbian, keeps adding this sentence back. I can understand he may want to underline his country's contribution to shaping Ivan's character and therefore shaping Russian history, but either he should do it in correct English or should stick to the pages written in Serbo-Croat, or whatever language it is they speak in Serbia.

858: 693: 2523:"Grozny" had been "formidable" in Russian since the 16th century up to now, but no to my knowledge source before the 18th century actually calls Ivan IV "Grozny". Vladimir Dahl is of little relevance here, since he lived in the 19th century and described later folklore (which he believed to be archaic, but which wasn't necessarily that). I would like to know when the English epithet "Terrible" first appeared. I would be happy if some native English speaker made any reference to the first attestation of it. As of present, the sobriquet section is very amateurish. 2424:

not that Jesus is terrible; he is good to just and good people but justly punishes the wicked. There is an icon know as "The Savior of the Terrible Eyes" now in the Tretiakov Gallery in Moscow. The _Domostroi_, written by Metropolitan Makary, a main advisor to Ivan in his early reign, also refers to a father being "grozen" in his household. See Maureen Perrie's book _The Image of Ivan the Terrible in Folklore_, pp. 62-3; Cherniavsky, "Ivan the Terrible as Renaissance Prince."; Domostroi Section 14: How to teach Children and Save them through Fear.

285: 1037:. I read original in old Slavic language. There literally wroten about Moscovian people and ruski people/ Cossacks in Zaporizhian Host/Cossack Hetmanate. Name of state was literally "Moscovian state". Nothing about Rus'. As for the Moscow ruler, the autocrat of Rus was mentioned only in the case of listing his titles, of which he had dozens. Among them were also the Khan, the tsar, the prince of all the khanates and principalities that Moscow had conquered by that time. 769: 738: 1459:

escape to Axedrovskaya Sloboda was pleaded to come back to his throne, one of his conditions was the right to establish Oprichnina. Originally this means the exceptional right for tsar to give estates directly to loyal people. Later word oprichnina becomes the synonym for exceptional rights of those people – oprichniks – over lives and possessions other citizens - Zemstvo. Usually estates were given by Zemsky Sobor. Thus the opposite of Oprichnina is Zemstvo.

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have been more careful. You're also right about the use of the word "formally". The sentence was so badly written that I didn't get that the author was trying to say "He formally came to the throne at the age of three, but during his minority, the country was ruled by his mother". Also, I explained how I would reword the sentence as stated. I didn't necessarily say that's how I would write it in the first place.

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unpredictable and unpredictably violent, thus rather than "terrible" a more appropriate translation, as suggested above, would be "frightening" or even "terrifying". Ivan was sufficiently crazy in a violent way that today he'd at a minimum have a prescription for serious meds and quite possibly would be an in-patient in a locked environment.

460: 1631:"He ascended the throne however a regency was required during his minority," would be much improved by a semicolon after "throne" and a comma after "however". But if I would probably say something more like, "In 1533, when Ivan was only three, his father died and Ivan became the Grand Duke. His mother, 4425:

That would be a fine translation, but it isn't actually used by anyone. Seriously, people need to understand that whatever the meaning of the words now, then, or in their own head, the fact remains that this guy is usually called "Ivan the Terrible" in English and that that is all that matters. Hell,

1808:

I refer to a passage in this article- "In one letter, he painfully recalls an episode when one drunken boyar put his dirty boots on Ivan's bed. These traumatic experiences doubtlessly contributed to his hatred of the boyars and to his mental instability." I'm trying to rid this article of garbage but

1560:

stilted! Let's analyze this sentence. Adding the word "formally" is confusing. If you state that someone formally does something, there is a strong assumption that they were informally doing it earlier. The sentence implies that Ivan was informally on the throne prior to his father's death - which is

3221:

The article shows a photo of Ivan looking over a woman: "Tsar Ivan IV admires his sixth wife Vasilisa Melentyevna (while sleeping)." However, if you click on the link to his first wife, Anastasia, you see the same picture with a different caption: "Ivan the Terrible at the deathbed of his first and

2423:

Grozny implies awe-inspiring and demanding respect, that he is harsh toward the wicked and good to the just - there is an aspect of justice in the term in the 1500s; Similarly Russians spoke of Jesus as the Terrible or Fearful Judge and of the Last Judgment as "The Fearful Judgment" (Strashnyi Sud);

2173:

In looking at the massacre in 1570, you could look at the sources in the Knowledge article specificially on the massacre; The casualty figures are not just for the town, but for the whole district, and it is unclear what the population was - I would say most population figures for the medieval and

2123:

What you need to do is to add facts and place a reference and page number for them. At present, reference three is faultily presented. One reference for each source here would be preferable, with a page number for published books, including chronicles. Editorial comment by the editor is not the done

1009:

LOL !!!! Article was edited after my words. And now absent word Russia because was Rus'. It is funny. Now appear word Grozniy - more better ! But article was stupid and it is now for fools. I am not going to say true more here. It was so funny to read english wiki. I asked about mistakes many people

4609:

All of which is irrelevant to the fact that the word (at least in reference to Russian monarchs) is generally spelled "Tsar". The spelling "Czar" is more commonly used in English for things like "drug czar". Basically, English doesn't care what usage "should" be, the question is simply "what IS the

3134:

In the early reign section, it reads "According to his own letters, Ivan customarily felt neglected and offended by the mighty boyars from the Shuisky and Belsky families. (These traumatic experiences may have contributed to his hatred of the boyars and to his mental instability. Alternatively, the

2482:

LeValley, the lede para does not "pretend" that Terrible is the correct translation of the Russian Гро́зный. It is saying that he is known in English as "Ivan the Terrrible" (which is undeniably true) and that he is known in Russian as "Ива́н Гро́зный" (which is equally undeniably true). That's

1676:

I'm glad you agree with my basic point. I enjoyed our debate about the sentence I used as an example but that was a sideshow. You're right about the semicolon. I don't normally use semicolons in informal communications such as this; however, given that I'm banging on about stilted writing, I should

1538:

I am a native speaker, and while I find that sentence slightly stilted, I can't imagine what about it you find "just horrible". "His minority" in this sense is slightly archaic (especially in U.S. English), and I might use "the period before he came of age", but other than that I don't see anything

4135:

Ivan the Terrible - означает Иван Ужасный, это не верно!!!(Terrible - страшный, ужасный, грозный, жуткий, ужасающий, чудовищный, кошмарный, отвратительный, убийственный), "Грозный"(Grozny) - означает, грозящий, угрожающий, тот у кого грозный вид, который пугает окружающих, Menacing (in some states

4063:

So the first sentences gives his name twice, as something in cyrillic which apparently transliterates as "Ivan Chetvyorty" and then another in cyrillic which transliterates as "Ivan Grozny". And the OGG soundbite for these BOTH comes out as "Ivan Grozny". Now I know there are issues with

2445:

If he is known to the English-speaking world as Ivan the Terrible and Knowledge wants to keep that usage, fine. But don't have the lead paragraph pretend that this is a correct translation of the Russian. Instead, say just that and then give the proper translation. Every native Russian-speaker I

2110:

4. My text: "In 1552 tsar won Kazan Khanate, whose armies repeatedly devastated the Northeast of Russia (ref), and annexed its territory. 1556 he annexed Astrakhan Khanate and destroyed the largest slave market on the river Volga. These gains of tsar complicated the migration of aggressive nomadic

1699:

The page is definitely edited by non-native English speakers, which I find annoying. I myself is non-native English speaker and refrain from writing or editing anything on English language pages. However I had to delete this sentence here: "Anna Glinsky (Jakšić) had a very significant role in the

1518:

I wonder if this article is being edited by non-native english speakers. The sentence "Upon his father's death, he formally came to the throne at the age of three, but his minority was dominated by the strong personality of his mother Elena Glinskaya" is just horrible. I have tried to edit some of

3360:

This is the sort of rhetoric that wiki editors should avoid. There is no reason such a proposition should be given credence as historians as far back as the 19th century have called Ivan “The Terrible” or “The Mad”. The opening line should be re-written to avoid the inaccuracy and bias reflected

3018:

Dang. I looked for information on his wives, but I didn't find that much. He apparently shipped some of them off to convents never to be heard from again, more or less, so they don't seem to be as well-documented. (I believe Henry wanted to ship Catherine of Aragon off to a convent, but it didn't

2852:

I think the word the writer intended was "unpremeditated". Ivan had nothing to gain from killing his son. It was the self-indulgent, momentary whim of an absolute monarch. According to William Durant's STORY OF CIVILIZATION, Ivan realized within minutes that he had not only committed a horrible

2285:

Ivan Grozny is the Russian name given to Ivan IV, almost invariably translated as "Ivan the Terrible" into English, but a reference should be made to its literal Russian meaning; "Ivan the Threatening". While a minor point from a historical point of view, it should perhaps be mentioned as it does

1458:

Oprichnina cannot be translated as “security” (ohrana), what an ignorant fool wrote that? Yes ignorant fool. The name of this organization, which could be translated as “something except of it” or “something beyond of it”, very good describes its role. When Ioann Grosny after his resignation and

4022:

A good example is that formation Oprichnina and Crimean raids are mentioned TWICE, as if these parts were written by different editors. At the same time article does not tell how and why Ivan launched Oprichnina (it completely misses the story of his staged abdication), and lacks any mention of

2457:

The verb grozit' (грозить) means "to threaten", as in "он грозил меня убить" "on grozil menya ubit'" "he threatened to kill me". The noun groza (гроза) means a violent storm with lots of energy-release, thunder, and lightning. So someone who's groznyj (грозный) would be like a bad storm that's

2427:

That said, I would argue that he is known to the English-speaking world as Ivan the Terrible, and calling him Ivan the Dread or Ivan the Awesome, or Ivan the Fear Inspiring but Orthodoxy Tsar confuses rather than elucidates. A point should be made to define his sobriquet, but he should not be

2106:

The Oprichnina was not the product of Ivan's paranoia. In the regions of Oprichnina (the Northeast of Russia) the number of large noble landowners was small. Basing on the Oprichnina, tsar wanted to suppress the nobility of the Southwest and the West of Russia, who did not support his struggle

1969:

Also i do suggest remove the image of painting named "Tsar Ivan IV mourns Anastasia Romanovna. 1875 painting by Grigory Semyonovich Sedov (1836-1886)" cause it is completely misleading showing a guy in his 60's or 70's while Ivan was young lad in his 30's when Anastasia died. I know that it is

1170:

Ivan IV officially and publicly abandoned the title of tsar in 1547following the destruction of Moscow by Devlet Girey, the han of Tatars, and a Tatar Sain-Bulat, or Semen Bekbulatovich was proclaimed tsar (Muscove tsars were vassals of Cimean Tatars, who were heirs of the Khans of the Golden

2102:

Ivan realized objective centralization tendencies. In Europe these tendencies conducted to overcoming of the feudal privileges and dissociation and to the building of the absolutistic state. It is necessary to remember the bloody acts of Henry VIII (England), Charles IX (France), Erik XIV

2092:

It is incorrect to declare famine and the devastation of Russia as result of the Oprichnina only. Authors of this opnion forget the Big Drought and the epidemics of plague in 1560s, the Polish-Lithuanian and Swedish raids on Russian territory (devastation of region Smolensk, Pskov, Novgorod,

4182:Пусть перевод будет популярным, но мы как носители языка не вкладываем в слово "Грозный" отрицательной коннотации. И не имеем в виду "ужас-ужас", слово родственно слову "гроза" и по смыслу должно переводиться как "строгий", "бескопромиссный", в плоть до "громовержца". Предлагаю это озвучить! 3170:

in the piece of text you‘ve added in the article there was some link, the linked text doesn't contain this information, so this piece of text remained unreferenced and thus should be removed. Please try not to add this piece of text again before you find an appropriate source for it. Thanks!

1032:

Not Rus' and not Russia. It was "Moscovian state" till the 1721, when Peter I stolen name Rus' from Ukraininans and Belarusians who name themselves in those time as ruthenians/rusines/rus people/russians. While Moscovites in documents named themselves separately as "Moscovian people" even in

2111:

hordes from Asia to Europe through Volga and transformed Russia into a multinational and multiconfessional state."... "He introduced the local self-management in rural regions, mainly in the Northeast of Russia, populated by the state peasantry. What in this versions frustrate my opponent?

2295:

Threatening doesn't quite do it justice either. It means 'terrible' in the old sense of the word, mighty and awe-inspiring. A russian friend said 'inspiring reverential dread' is an excellent phrase to describe the adjective. English just doesn't have the particular vocabulary for a direct

2068:

Previous text: """ In a dispute with the wealthy city of Novgorod, Ivan ordered the Oprichniks to murder inhabitants of this city, which was never to regain its former prosperity. Between thirty and forty thousand might have been killed during the infamous Massacre of Novgorod in 1570 """

1248:

Why does the first picture have the caption "Tsar Ioann IV the Terrible"? In what relevant language is he Ioann? Is this Latin? I can't think what else it would be. In both English and Russian he is "Ivan", though of course the vowels have different values and the accent falls differently.

2707:

The problem is not confined to Russian. Italian writers in the early 1500s frequently stated that Pope Julius II possessed "terribilita" (literally, terribleness), but that Michelangelo could stand up to him because the artist also had "terribilita". They meant that they both men were

1539:

particularly wrong with it. Could you be clearer about what you find "horrible": you say that you "tried to edit some of the mangled writing in this article", but obviously you didn't do so under the account name you are now using, since it is nowhere to be found in the edit history. --

2315:

I think "Formidable" (as in "formidable foe") may be a better translation. Terrible translates as "Страшный" or "Ужасный", first one means "awe-inspiring", and second one can have two different meangings - "awe-inspiring" and "very bad", so it's not the best choice of a word.

3308:

I have no idea who keeps putting on this article that Ivan IV was murdered, but the sources they use either are about something else entirely or state that the idea is very unlikely. If you're going to make a statement like that it needs to be backed up with real sources.

2999:

Not sure what you mean. There's a reference to his 7 wives as part of a photo caption, but that's likely to be overlooked, and apart from Anastasia there's no mention of his marriages anywhere. Nor is there mention of any of his 8 children, apart from Feodor I. --

2242:

I have a map here published by Rand McNally & Company that indicates that Siberia was acquired by Russia between 1598 and 1689. Since Ivan dies before 1598, his reign could not have seen the conquest of Siberia as indicated in the first paragraph of the article.

2296:

translation. While a few people still know the old usage of 'terrible' its very unlikely that succeeding generations will, so perhaps a better translation is in order. My Russian professor suggested 'thunderous' but that doesn't quite sound correct in english.(S.L)

1093:

Considering that many historians do indeed judge Ivan to have been deranged, I think this article should consider this view as well as the view that Ivan was a farsighted, sane statesman. As is the article is learning towards the sane side more than is appropriate.

2265:

As far as I know Ermak and his cossaks defeated the khanate of Siberia in 1581 near the place where the city of Tobolsk currently stands. So you can say Ivan conquered Siberia, even though Russian troops reached the Pacific shores much later due to the vastness of

1198:. the Muscovites would continue to be vassals of the Crimean Khanate, if not for the alliance with the Ukrainian Cossacks in 1654. Actually, the Muscovites were became able to conquer the Crimea only thanks to the Ukrainians (Zaporizka Sich and Cossack Hetmanate). 3089:

Her name was Maria Cherkasskaya. I provided all the names of his 7 wives above, with details of the other children as well, with a link to where I found them all. All it needs is someone to put them into the article, because I'm crap with infoboxes. --

2501:

As someone who is new to researching Ivan, I find the addition of the "Terrible" misleading. I assumed the English translation of Terrible and preventing others from knowing its true nature does a disservice to Wikepedia users like myself. My 2 cents.

2060: 2614:

is not an academic work and is not period-specific, I was unable to find any references to "John the Dread" in it anyway. The index points to several pages where "Ivan the Terrible" is used, though. Are you confusing this book with some other book,

3989:

Please don't justify tyranism by mental problems. Modern researchers, basing on the analysis of the remains of Ivan, assume the mercury poisoning of tsar (as well as at his mother Helena Glinskaya). The mercury poisoning destroyed his mental health.

2960:

In the article we mention his son Ivan, whom he killed on 16 November 1581. But there’s some suggestion that he also killed Dmitri (1), on 3 July 1583 (or maybe they were getting confused with Ivan). Dmitri (2) supposedly died aged 9, in 1591, but

2927:

But he had 6 children with Anastasia - Anna, Maria, Dmitri (1), Ivan, Evodokia, and Feodor. And he married 6 more times (people talk of the 6 wives of Henry VIII, but never about the 7 wives of Ivan the Terrible) and produced 2 more children.

3767:

That's already been answered - it's because in this case the cognomen is vastly better recognized. If the only arguments against this are based solely on false statements about naming conventions, I think we can say we have effective consensus

2781:"Degradation of Knowledge"? - wouldn't that imply that Knowledge was some respectable, august, or honorable institution in order for it to be debased? Isn't it just a mass of people writing what they want on any subject under the sun? :) -- 2384:

Note: I once heard of a lecture in which a historian started by explaining that "terrible" was not a good translation. After subsequently summarizing Ivan's career he concluded: "Now that I think about it, he really WAS pretty terrible".

1422:

No good reason. Both are acceptable, though I think contemporary usage is leaning towards "tsar" for the literal meaning and "czar" for the metaphorical (such as "drug czar"). Within one article, we ought to stick to one or the other. --

3248:

I was looking up Ivan the Terrible after playing AoEIII, thinking who exactly was this guy... This page scared me. I believe the introduction section needs to be redone. It seems really messy and the thoughts seem rather scattered.

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Ivan the allegedly "terrible" is a totally TERRIBLY wrong and ignorant translation, this includes also the western lies about his "terrible" leadership... Ivan the dreadful is the right translation of his name, not "terrible".

3999:

Notice that "the" is sometimes left out when it should be there in Russian articles. Just saying. English avoids overuse but it's still used or it sounds like a Russian speaking English, or a Yorkshire person "put kettle on".

2023:

of Eisenstein only in "See Also" section is just not right. With three parts, including one censored and one unfinished, the filming project of the Tsar's life played a considerable part in creation of his modern legend.

1576:

Remove all the garbage and the sentence is changed to - "His father died when Ivan was only three. He ascended the throne however a regency was required during his minority. His mother, Elena Glinskaya assumed power."

1866:, doing a random article search. There is no mention of Andrey Kurbsky in the Ivan IV article. I added a link under SEE ALSO, but someone who is more knowledgable than me may wish to add it in to the main article. -- 153: 1959:

Is it possible to get a higher-resolution image of the Ilya Repin painting (Ivan the Terrible killing his son)? The particularly haunting expression on Ivan's face doesn't come through in the current small version.

2585:

The abstract notes that Terrible in this context is its archaic form of 'inspiring fear.' Perhaps it should, for clarity, give an alternate translation to exemplify this, "Ivan the Awesome" or "Ivan the Fearsome."

4115:

At birth, he received the name of Iona, baptized by Ioann Vasilievich. When diplomats mistakenly called him Ivan arose international conflicts and about it all who were interested in History known. See Talk Marfa

3950:

His long reign saw the conquest of the Khanates of Kazan, Astrakhan, and Siberia, transforming Russia into a multiethnic and multiconfessional state spanning almost one billion acres, approximately 130 km2 (50 sq

3809:

is a name known almost universally, and by many who would have no idea of his regnal number. The only argument against the move above appeals to a convention that explicitly does not apply in cases such as this.

2004:

out of material that had been deleted from the biography article. Since cultural references sometimes get deleted without discussion, I'd like to suggest this approach as a model for the editors here. Regards,

2729:

I have removed the semi-protection of the article. You should now be able to make this change yourself (I could, of course, do it for you, but am unwilling to due to implications with the attribution of the

2814:

If you have an argument with someone, and strike him in the head with a staff, how exactly does that constitute an "accident"? Manslaughter rather than murder, by modern evaluation, but hardly an accident.

3500:

wholeheartedly. Having "of Russia" in the title is completely unnecessary (no other country had ever been ruled by an "Ivan IV"), and Ivan the Terrible is indeed the most common name by which this Tsar is

1088:

Exact translation of Ivan Grozny's nickname and toning down of his presumably "mad" character, as well as the commentary about the goal of Oprichina was supplemented by G.N.Boiko-Slastion on Nov.30,2003.

1839: 1730: 2150:

Now that section says that there were up to 60,000 killed - in a town of 10-20,000. What the hell? Somebody fix it! I don't know enough to, but I can sure recognize an error like that when I see it!

4165:О черт, я об этом забыл, обычно я не такой беспечный, мне пора отдыхать!) Уже хотел добавить для разъяснения пару примеров, что бы было понятно о чем я говорю "Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace")) 2672:

The epithet "Grozny" is associated with might, power and strictness, rather than poor performance, horror or cruelty. Some authors more accurately translate it into modern English as Ivan the Awesome ."

2332:

It is not Knowledge's job to determine what "a better translation" might be. The vast majority of English-language sources use "Terrible", hence that's what the title of the Knowledge's article is. See

1899:

it's been suggested that perhaps the easiest way to enforce the wiki conventions on naming of rulers would be to move all articles to the proper title and this one was given as an example. Any ideas on

3202:

magazine. The web version only provides the beginning of the article but the material is reasonably clear (and a public knowledge anyway). I will add another sources over recognition of Ivan IV claims

2832:

The result of striking his son on the head (the death) was probably an accident. The act however, would almost definitely be considered manslaughter, but the killing, to our knowledge was an accident.

4339:

he did supply reliable sources, the lineage is confirmed by articles on wikipedia which is a reliable source, no? Because each of the links is wiki article and hence is confirmed by a reliable source.

1835: 1974: 3856:

If it were done again, you could add my name in support of the move to "Ivan the Terrible" and PMAndersen has stated the same in another forum. That would make it 6-2, a much clearer consensus. --

2542: 2096:

In 1560s the grain prices have grown ten times. Epidemic of the plague killed 10,000 in Novgorod. In 1570 the plague killed 600-1000 in Moscow daily. (R.Skrynnikov, "Ivan Grosny", M., AST, 2001)

1214:

Nonsense. Moscow tsars were never vassals of crrimean tatars. Great dukes of Moscow were vassals of Golden Horde and called their sovereigns "tsar". Crimean khans were vassals of turkish sultans.

2689:

meaning "most formidable" rather than the modern one, which might suggest poor performance, horror or cruelty. Some authors more accurately translate it into modern English as Ivan the Awesome."

2223:

It is true that Kolomenskoe was near Moscow in 1530; it is now well within the city of Moscow, four stops on the Metro from Teatralnaya on the Second Line, four miles or so from the Kremlin. --

1581:

Of course I expect Russian articles to be edited by Russians. However I don't expect to clean up non-native English speakers' grammar, only to see it reverted back to it's original stilted form.

2085:

The official data were fair enough. It is the report of the commander of Oprichniki Maljuta Skuratov and commemoration lists of tsar. Would he lie before the God, being the religious person?

4094:

I think "Четвёртый-Chetvyorty-Fourth" must be deleted. I've never seen similar things in other articles. Who needs the transcription of russian numerals? BTW he was Ivan I until 19 century.

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Ioann Grosny was the first Russian tsar. Prior to him the title tsar (from latin Caesar) was used in Russia for Byzantine emperors and Mongolian khans. Not to mention this fact is ignorance.

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On the assumption that Czar is the equivalent of Caesar and a claim to be a Roman Empire ruler, would it not be better to spell it Czar instead of Tsar, since Czar looks more like Caesar? (

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If a link is changed from blue to red, it's clearly something that should be reverted without hesitation. If someone has an issue with how the target article is titled, there is always

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LOL. The Russians are pros at distorting their own history. Half of which they don't know themselves b/c anyone who told the truth was murdered, jailed, banished or all of the above.

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Anon, these are typical secondary sources. They were written in the 20th or 21st centuries. Primary sources should date to the 16th century. Are you sure that your additions are not an

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2. If a monarch or prince is overwhelmingly known, in English, by a cognomen, it may be used. Examples: Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Louis the Pious, Henry the Lion, Skanderbeg, etc.

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In modern English, Terrible means 1) Inspiring terror, and 2) rubbish. Dreadful means 1) inspiring dread, and 2) rubbish. Both translations are equally good (or terrible/dreadful).

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I've heard (not knowing Russian myself) that in the name "Peter the Great", the "Great" represents "grozny" in the original Russian. So can't we call the earlier tsar Ivan the Great?

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all. It's also true that if he were a much more recent historical figure than he was, we'd probably be calling him "Ivan the Awesome" or whatever. But he wasn't and we don't. --

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This opening appears biased, however, your point about it being mentioned "as far back as the 19th century" in no way debunks the original claim. Just thought I'd point that out.

2564:

UPDATE: Slavic language speaker here. I can confirm that the term "grozny" translates almost directly to "fearsome" I am surprised this translation is not used more consistently.

4117: 1743:. I do not think this should be the case, but am not going to keep reverting it. I think the argument is that the cathedral is called "St. Vasili" by local people, but this is 2082:

The number of 30-40 thousand victims is represented as finished proved statement. Though these figures strongly contradict even to a population of city to 1570 (10,000-20,000).

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that the article is often edited by non-native English speakers. Virtually all topics related to Russia are significantly worked on by Russians: would you have it any other way?

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It's not the wrong translation. The lies aren't western either. They're yours. He was a horrible man no matter what you choose to call him. LOL. "Ivan the Wonderful" right?

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Ivan Grozniy was Tsar of Rus' not Russia ! Rus' was until 1721 and became Russia in 1721(Petr Great). U can read this date and about Petr Great in wiki. Serega(27.01.2016)

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The way I would read "his minority was dominated by the strong personality of his mother" is not that he, personally, was dominated by his mother but that during the

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thing, even in notes. And it is always best to reference opposing sources where sources clash, or the reader will then only see a partial interpretation of events.

4688: 4187: 3350: 2744:"Terrible", "dread" etc. What's the difference? LOL. He was a horrible person and a crappy ruler and anyone with any sense knows it. Russians excluded, of course. 2271: 2254: 1852: 1712: 575: 3955:

One billion acres making 130 km2 while this all express Russian state of Khanates of Kazan, Astrakhan and Siberia included. Any explanation will be appreciated.--

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Yaroslavl, South-West etc), attacks of Tatars of Crimea (They even burnt down Moscow), the trading blockade carried out by Swedes, Poles and Hanseatic League.

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And for the second one: "In imitation of Henry VIII of England, Ivan married 7 times…" "In imitation of…" seems very unlikely, is there a citation for this? --

3336:"The English mistranslation of the historical name of Ivan IV stems from traditional American propaganda's intention to distort and demonize Russian history." 2948: 976:

The bloody mire of Mongolian slavery, not the rude glory of the Norman epoch, forms the cradle of Muscovy, and modern Russia is but a metamorphosis of Muscovy.

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who ruled over most of Eurasia. Only later were they split, both geographically and temporally, to create the 'different' rulers we have in textbooks today.

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My Russian mother, who lectured in Durham University, preferred the translation "the Dread" for Grozny. As I recall it, this translation is also used in

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if the common English name for him was "Susan the Sweet", that's where the article would be and there would be nothing that could be said against it. --

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Literal meaning of "Grozny" is closer to "threatening", from "грозить" - "to threat". This epithet is not derogatory, but does not mean "great" anyway.

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The result of the proposal was moved per consensus below that, in this case, the common name should be used rather than the MOS regnal number style.--

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When this man reigned "terrible" MEANT "inspiring terror". It was a synonym of "dreadful". The translation simply hasn't been changed since then. --

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and proposed to marry her. As his own letters show, he was aware of the authoritorian policies of her father as well. See Skrynnikov for details. --

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probably intentionally made by artistic means but on site like wikipedia that is also educational it is unhistorical and misleading...So not good.

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I was under the impression you were only suposed to edit something if you were neutral like I couldn't make any major edits on Canada for example.

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know would use Äwe-Inspiring or Thundrous or even Awesome as the correct translation into modern English.--LeValley 22:51, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

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Russian transliteration, but you can't get "Chetvyorty" from "Grozny". Now we all know what "Grozny" means, what does "Chetyvorty" mean ?

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I think failing to describe the archaic nature of the adjective "Terrible" is confusing. I'd like to expand the sentence in the introduction

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Only about roughly 6 editors took part in this RM & there's a 4-2 in favour of moving. I'd hardly call this a consensus to move to

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Church Slavonic and lofty Russian parlance sound worth a mention, but not an unexplained use in a caption; I'll deal with this one. --

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Not suggesting an edit, but my hobby in philology compels me to wonder if "intimidating" would be a valid interpretation of "грозный"

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Moscovian state paid tribute to Crkmean Khanate till 1700 year, when Moscovian state concluded an agreement with the Ottoman Empire -

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Shouldn't we mention that he opened Archangelsk as a major port? That was pretty significant, he opened up trade with the English.

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

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Agree. I was tempted to close this as rough consensus, but decided to vote instead. Hopefully that will give us a clearer decision.

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Overall really badly edited. "What had been by far the richest area of Russia became the poorest" - What area are we talking about?

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Someone added a default template which used "Ivan" as a first name and Terrible as a surname. I removed it. Thanks for noticing.

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And, yes, it's a pain if people whose mastery of the language is less than yours are editing your merely editorial changes. --

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Actually "terrible" aptly applies to every*single*Russian ruler since day one including the current putz. Why mince words?

4191: 2300:"Thunderous" sounds fine in English. That seems to be the most accurate translation, since "groza" in Russian is "thunder". 2275: 4902: 4827: 4720: 4700: 4101: 3393: 3379: 2833: 2571: 1947: 1307:, and built the Old English Embassy near the Kremlin, which still may be seen. He maintained a regular correspondence with 1151: 1017: 1003: 382: 4653: 4526: 3354: 1468:

Comparison with Henry VIII is evidence that the author of this article gather his knowledge in yellow press. Try The Times

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I've started an approach that may apply to Knowledge's Core Biography articles: creating a branching list page based on

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Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

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Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

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illustrate the subtle, but definetly different takes on the character from the West and in English-speaking countries.

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in October without even a move request. "Ivan the Terrible" is on the same scale in terms of being easily recognized.—

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This comment was hidden within the article. I thought it would be better to bring it to the fore on the talk page. --

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No... and you should also notice that the article for the TV show "Ninja Warrior" is twice as long as this article.--

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Yuri was spelled two ways Yuri and lurii, is that a mistake or is it just spelled differently because of translation?

814: 4728: 4512: 2645:' "A History of Russia" - which I have in front of me now! (I've since unpacked my mum's books out of storage.) :-) 944:

p.s. and he was Grozniy, not terrible. You can mean this as stern. Too many mistakes in article. Serega(20.02.2016)

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The fact that Ioann Grosny himself dissolved Oprichnina and even forbid to mention this word is obviously forgotten

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Peter the Great is Pyotr Velikii. Ivan the Terrible is Ivan Grozny. Different words with very different meanings.

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it keeps on getting reverted. What do you mean by saying "Ivan's brains were sharper than ours". More garbage.

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It was not the first time, when Ioann Grosny resigned. Remember Alexandrovskaya sloboda. Or better read a book.

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The number of victims of Novgorod massacre is very overestimated. The article contains other mistakes also

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Ivan is descended from the last Armenian King and the last Greek Emperor. Isn't this worthy of noting? --

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Question: Was he born in 1534 or 1533? Sources talk I believe he was the czar in 1533, but i'm not sure.

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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with

4079:

Removed the duplicate, as I couldn't find an ogg file for Ivan IV Vasilyevich. Chetvyorty means fourth.

3407:. I am not sure when exactly it was added, but this article does occasionally get "drive-by" POV edits. 3135:

negative feelings revealed in his letters may have been a reflection of his disagreeable temperament.)"

3067:. It is said that the marriage was of a political nature to solidify the grip of the Russian Empire on 4511:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit 4459: 4272: 4231: 4219: 3941: 2575: 1377:

There is a line of thought that "Ivan IV" and "Henry VIII"(as well as "Charles V" of Austria) were the

2685:"Grozny" is associated with might, power and strictness, and corresponds to the archaic definition of 1784:

Why would a drunken Boyar putting his dirty boots on Ivan's bed contribute to his mental instability?

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I have to say that this part of the article is really weak. I mean, mentioning a movie standard like

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I don't speak Russian, but in context, perhaps "Ivan the Terrifying" best gets the point across? -

1798:. What "mental instability" do you talk about, by the way? Ivan's brains were sharper than ours. -- 1605:. To use the word slightly differently, "his accession at the age of three was an empty formality." 4569: 4320:

supporting this lineage (and preferably elaborating on its significance). What you have above is

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because I have gathered that the Kabard princess was his 2nd spouse and her name was first name

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Novgorod was not prospering city to 1570 after the epidemics of plague and the famine of 1560s.

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Simeon Bekbulatovich was only one year a tsar, after that Ioann Grosny take this title back.

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of Henry VIII? Is there a citation for that claim, because it seems a bit bizarre to me. --

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the mangled writing in this article, only to see it reverted back to the previous rubbish.

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Google Books has english "Ivan the Terrible" (228,000) and "Ivan the Fearsome" (6 hits).--

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The overall impression of this article – it written by someone who neglect to read books.

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Isn't the part inside the parinthesis just speculation? Shouldn't that part be removed?

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https://web.archive.org/web/20120510033800/http://www.kinokultura.com/plus/prokat2.html

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Last edited at 23:55, 14 January 2011 (UTC). Substituted at 19:13, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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We need it to be completely re-arranged. Russian article has a good structure to copy:

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It is very frustrating to see a rather neutral article ruined by tendentious editing...

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and I still don't have an answer to this. I'm very inclined to change this caption. --

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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with

3628:. Google Books shows how much more common "Ivan the Terrible" is. "Ivan IV of Russia" 3575:

Good catch; if this one is successful, I'll probably request that one be moved next.

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The use of the word "formally" does not imply that informal accession was necessarily

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films (or to Eisenstein himself until the articles are written) would be appropriate.

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I beg your pardon, You are right - I was wrong: I confused Hedrick Smith's work with

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Still better than 99% of western rulers with their inquisitions and witch-burnings.

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In this article was Russia on 27/01/2016 ! But in article about Petr 1 was Rus'.))

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Or that he didn't do it informally for some time, which, being three, he didn't.

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There isn't much known about Ivan so this will be a difficult article to add to!

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Wrong you are. Moskovia, not Rus. Those Asian despots had no connections to Rus.

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I'm unregistered so I can't. Someone remove the broken BBC link at the bottom.

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To clarify, should we mention how the English got there in the first place?

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is useless. Next time try to examine the subject properly before reverting.

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when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information.

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rulers of Russia until Ivan assumed power in 1544." More information, too.

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The article is chaotic, pathetically emotional, and lacks any structure.

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reasonable edit made in the main body of this article since last year. --

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For what its worth, my past edits weren't under my current account name.

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An editor has reviewed this edit and fixed any errors that were found.

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Feel free to edit the article attached to this page, join up at the

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Actually, Ivan maintained close ties with England, patronized the

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal.

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Agreed, good catch. I removed that bit, which certainly violates

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Did Ivan at any time have more than one wife at the same time?--

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Karl Marx, Secret Diplomatic History of the 18th Century (1899)

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Yes, that's another case in point, and should be moved back to

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Looks like a blog source, which list references. Not reliable.

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Anyone know if Ivan had a signature when writing his name?

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I am sorry but I am unable to understand the following line:

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I noticed that omission. Has it been fixed and I missed it?--

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The infobox mentions only Feodor I as his offspring and only

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Russian, Soviet and CIS military history task force articles

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Here are the primary sources (since the BBC doesnt suffice)

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for additional information. I made the following changes:

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Ioann Grosny passed the first death sentence when aged 13.

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Tsar is used by Oxford Dictionary, Czar in Merriam Webster

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C-Class Russian, Soviet and CIS military history articles

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Those examples are not nearly as well known as Ivan's.

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The 1911 Brittanica Novgorod article (reference 3) says

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the Russian, Soviet, and CIS military history task force

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Horde). Does anyone have information about this event?

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as monarchial article title includes a regnal number.

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The following is a closed discussion of the proposal.

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information. I started that last year while I raised

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These details all need to get into the article. --

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A fact from this article was featured on Knowledge's

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Would it be better to spell in English Tsar as Czar?

3424:, which was just added yesterday. Anyway, reverted. 2898:

not fewer than 15 thousand, 60 000 by some estimates

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Ivan IV(Ivan the Terrible) was born in Kolomenskoye

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It borders on the ridiculous. I'm going to pull it.

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St. Basil's Cathedral in Moscow is called St. Vasili

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This article has been checked against the following

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Yeah, that was one of those "drive-by" POV/OR edits

2965:claimed that he had survived and that he was him. 1876:

You should have read the article more carefully. --

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Russian, Soviet and CIS military history task force

3126:No he did not, but he had innumerable mistresses. 2879:http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat0.htm#IvanT 3915:Now that this move succeeded, I've proposed that 2955:(1580), who produced a final child, Dmitri (2). 4734: 4521:http://www.portal-slovo.ru/rus/history/89/11372/ 3731:Doesn't have to, but if it's allowed, why not? 2358:THIS HELPED ME A LOT IN MY ASSINGMENT. THANKS. 33:for general discussion of the article's subject. 4470:, and are posted here for posterity. Following 2935:(1561), who produced a son Vassily. Then came 2079:Ivan did not ordered to kill all city dwellers. 1324:But is there any basis to say he married women 4037:Foreign policy (divided to Diplomacy and Wars) 1479:The massacre of Poganaya Yama is not mentioned 4630:When in category, Ivan the Terrible is under 4464:The comment(s) below were originally left at 4326:Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) 3590:Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) 3503:Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) 2732:Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) 2617:Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) 2419:Ivan III (r. 1462-1505)was "Ivan the Great". 2339:Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) 1769:Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) 174: 4808:Low-importance biography (military) articles 4531:http://www.kinokultura.com/plus/prokat2.html 2853:personal act but also destroyed his dynasty. 4823:Low-importance biography (royalty) articles 2072:This paragraph contains a lot of mistakes. 4788:Knowledge level-4 vital articles in People 3925:Talk:Catherine II of Russia#Requested move 3584:As an FYI, Peter I of Russia was moved to 3222:most-beloved wife, Anastasia Romanovna." 2002:Cultural depictions of Alexander the Great 4503:I have just modified 2 external links on 4316:It may be worthy of noting if you supply 3970:Moving hidden comment from within article 1639:until her death in 1538. Thereafter, the 1601:, just at a different time, in this case 4873:Early Modern warfare task force articles 1975:Cultural depictions of Ivan IV of Russia 525:This article is within the scope of the 467:This article is listed on the project's 273: 4888:Top-importance C-Class Russia articles 4813:Military biography work group articles 4735: 4636:Is there a specific reason he's under 2610:Ignoring, for a moment, the fact that 2107:against Poland, Lithuania and Sweden. 545:Knowledge:WikiProject Military history 535:. To use this banner, please see the 4898:History of Russia task force articles 4868:C-Class Early Modern warfare articles 4803:C-Class biography (military) articles 4763:Selected anniversaries (January 2011) 4758:Selected anniversaries (January 2007) 4753:Selected anniversaries (January 2006) 4748:Selected anniversaries (January 2005) 4034:Internal Policy (includes Oprichnina) 548:Template:WikiProject Military history 4818:C-Class biography (royalty) articles 4673:Really applies to all Russian rulers 4211:Descendant of Leo I and Michael VIII 3887:& one I just correctly reverted 1739:to redirect to the nonexistent link 1144:Dude, where's this dude's library? 1110:He was not born on janurary 18 1993 790:This article is within the scope of 371:This article is within the scope of 269: 227: 184: 4480:Article does not cite its sources. 303:It is of interest to the following 23:for discussing improvements to the 13: 4778:Knowledge vital articles in People 1994:Cultural depictions of Joan of Arc 1396:Why are both used in the article? 876: 856: 707: 691: 675: 560: 458: 434: 410: 14: 4914: 4893:C-Class Russia (history) articles 4853:C-Class military history articles 4843:Top-importance biography articles 4833:C-Class biography (core) articles 4507:. Please take a moment to review 4472:several discussions in past years 3879:Other odd moves to nicknames are 2040:Tendentious editing by Bel-Velvel 1735:An anonymous user wants links to 422:the military biography work group 4793:C-Class vital articles in People 4773:Knowledge level-4 vital articles 4539: 4324:, which is a big no-no. Cheers,— 3596:); January 10, 2011; 15:59 (UTC) 937:Whats a big mistake in article ! 868:the history of Russia task force 777: 767: 736: 632: 621: 610: 599: 588: 518: 486: 446:WikiProject Royalty and Nobility 358: 348: 316: 283: 274: 231: 188: 45:Click here to start a new topic. 4519:Corrected formatting/usage for 4467:Talk:Ivan the Terrible/Comments 3509:); January 6, 2011; 16:35 (UTC) 1620:the court and hence the country 1465:The reason for it of course too 1196:Treaty of Constantinople (1700) 1035:Treaty of Constantinople (1700) 843:This article has been rated as 717:Early Modern warfare task force 395:Knowledge:WikiProject Biography 212:Content must be written from a 196:The subject of this article is 4883:Top-importance Russia articles 4848:WikiProject Biography articles 4783:C-Class level-4 vital articles 4743:Knowledge controversial topics 4709:15:46, 24 September 2023 (UTC) 3657:and multiple examples such as 3198:The source is an article from 3155:Changing the name of the state 3041:Ivan married a Kabard princess 2916:Seven wives and eight children 2738:); 19:12, March 18, 2009 (UTC) 2625:18:00, 29 September 2008 (UTC) 2414:05:46, 15 September 2007 (UTC) 2337:for the applicable guideline.— 1965:09:05, 14 September 2006 (UTC) 1824:15:07, 14 September 2006 (UTC) 1775:); March 23, 2010; 20:44 (UTC) 1264:and lofty Russian parlance. -- 398:Template:WikiProject Biography 1: 4454:10:46, 2 September 2019 (UTC) 4386:00:58, 16 November 2017 (UTC) 4365:13:24, 10 December 2015 (UTC) 4344:Wront translation of his name 3923:by the same reasoning. See: 2910:11:49, 22 February 2008 (UTC) 2891:02:15, 22 February 2008 (UTC) 2863:17:33, 18 December 2009 (UTC) 2752:I've been unable to detect a 2718:17:43, 18 December 2009 (UTC) 2539:2601:98A:4000:C980:0:0:0:6E24 2377:Another translation of Grozny 2310:03:27, 21 November 2008 (UTC) 2276:12:04, 27 November 2010 (UTC) 2217:03:32, 27 February 2007 (UTC) 2167:03:49, 15 November 2007 (UTC) 2144:05:50, 16 November 2006 (UTC) 2129:19:04, 13 November 2006 (UTC) 2118:18:43, 13 November 2006 (UTC) 2103:(Sweden) and Spanish kings. 2056:18:31, 13 November 2006 (UTC) 1794:Address this question to Dr. 1721:11:55, 27 November 2010 (UTC) 1622:were dominated by his mother. 1337:22:37, 15 December 2005 (UTC) 1316:20:54, 14 December 2005 (UTC) 1298:19:58, 14 December 2005 (UTC) 1284:22:37, 15 December 2005 (UTC) 1269:20:54, 14 December 2005 (UTC) 1010:for fun. Serega(12.08.2016) 885:This article is supported by 865:This article is supported by 685:Military biography task force 443:This article is supported by 419:This article is supported by 42:Put new text under old text. 4729:22:07, 6 February 2022 (UTC) 4693:10:20, 26 January 2022 (UTC) 4402:18:29, 30 January 2019 (UTC) 4175:09:06, 7 November 2012 (UTC) 4161:09:00, 7 November 2012 (UTC) 4146:08:53, 7 November 2012 (UTC) 4110:15:21, 20 October 2012 (UTC) 4010:13:37, 20 October 2011 (UTC) 3984:07:10, 22 January 2011 (UTC) 3965:13:53, 16 January 2011 (UTC) 3937:00:25, 15 January 2011 (UTC) 3901:23:34, 21 January 2011 (UTC) 3875:12:23, 21 January 2011 (UTC) 3866:01:07, 21 January 2011 (UTC) 3851:23:43, 20 January 2011 (UTC) 3820:20:58, 14 January 2011 (UTC) 3792:21:02, 14 January 2011 (UTC) 3778:07:15, 12 January 2011 (UTC) 3759:04:23, 12 January 2011 (UTC) 3613:21:02, 14 January 2011 (UTC) 3472:23:53, 14 January 2011 (UTC) 3355:10:25, 26 January 2022 (UTC) 3327:23:27, 10 January 2010 (UTC) 3299:21:48, 7 November 2009 (UTC) 3285:21:46, 7 November 2009 (UTC) 3212:07:01, 3 February 2009 (UTC) 3180:03:01, 3 February 2009 (UTC) 2842:04:05, 26 October 2009 (UTC) 2655:12:38, 21 October 2008 (UTC) 2014:17:20, 17 October 2006 (UTC) 1692:18:15, 16 January 2007 (UTC) 1569:01:24, 4 November 2006 (UTC) 1432:16:24, 18 January 2006 (UTC) 1361:01:21, 21 January 2006 (UTC) 1190:08:15, 1 December 2005 (UTC) 1176:00:23, 1 December 2005 (UTC) 823:Knowledge:WikiProject Russia 528:Military history WikiProject 383:contribute to the discussion 7: 4903:WikiProject Russia articles 4828:Royalty work group articles 4485:00:35, 25 August 2006 (UTC) 4053:11:41, 9 January 2012 (UTC) 3736:23:44, 8 January 2011 (UTC) 3727:20:33, 8 January 2011 (UTC) 3710:19:22, 8 January 2011 (UTC) 3688:17:09, 8 January 2011 (UTC) 3671:17:06, 8 January 2011 (UTC) 3646:23:39, 7 January 2011 (UTC) 3580:15:45, 7 January 2011 (UTC) 3571:14:39, 7 January 2011 (UTC) 3550:12:05, 7 January 2011 (UTC) 3541:05:56, 7 January 2011 (UTC) 3492:16:24, 6 January 2011 (UTC) 2825:16:27, 3 January 2008 (UTC) 2606:10:14, 19 August 2008 (UTC) 2580:16:00, 15 August 2018 (UTC) 2545:) 15:42, 22 May 2020 (UTC) 2533:19:16, 7 January 2016 (UTC) 2197:Moscow not actually there. 2000:. Recently I also created 1514:Non-native english speakers 1026:20:04, 12 August 2016 (UTC) 826:Template:WikiProject Russia 206:When updating the article, 50:New to Knowledge? Welcome! 10: 4919: 4798:C-Class biography articles 4584:03:55, 16 April 2017 (UTC) 4500:Hello fellow Wikipedians, 4273:Andronikos III Palaiologos 4232:Andronikos III Palaiologos 4220:Isabella, Queen of Armenia 4205:16:37, 20 April 2014 (UTC) 4192:02:48, 16 April 2013 (UTC) 4126:04:36, 30 March 2019 (UTC) 3870:A very odd move indeed. -- 3380:06:30, 28 April 2016 (UTC) 2805:13:10, 5 August 2007 (UTC) 2791:00:53, 12 March 2009 (UTC) 2776:14:19, 11 March 2009 (UTC) 2702:18:55, 18 March 2009 (UTC) 2518:06:22, 28 April 2016 (UTC) 2492:23:11, 19 March 2014 (UTC) 2468:22:55, 19 March 2014 (UTC) 2438:00:46, 12 March 2009 (UTC) 2233:00:16, 12 March 2009 (UTC) 2184:00:00, 12 March 2009 (UTC) 1853:09:17, 24 April 2006 (UTC) 1814:10:54, 15 April 2006 (UTC) 1803:11:38, 14 April 2006 (UTC) 1789:10:59, 14 April 2006 (UTC) 1758:20:39, 23 March 2010 (UTC) 1682:12:19, 10 April 2006 (UTC) 1524:11:55, 27 March 2006 (UTC) 1208:03:26, 26 March 2023 (UTC) 1160:21:49, 18 March 2011 (UTC) 1047:03:40, 26 March 2023 (UTC) 1004:03:42, 26 March 2023 (UTC) 989:03:44, 26 March 2023 (UTC) 932:12:56, 10 April 2019 (UTC) 849:project's importance scale 593:Referencing and citation: 4668:21:29, 13 June 2019 (UTC) 4654:01:11, 13 June 2019 (UTC) 4479: 4265:Andronikos II Palaiologos 4089:06:42, 24 June 2012 (UTC) 4074:06:30, 24 June 2012 (UTC) 3434:16:06, 15 July 2010 (UTC) 3417:05:24, 15 July 2010 (UTC) 3394:05:09, 15 July 2010 (UTC) 3265:17:29, 14 July 2009 (UTC) 3186:P.S. besides that adding 3167:. Alex Bakharev, although 3150:05:33, 30 July 2008 (UTC) 3122:11:50, 23 July 2008 (UTC) 3100:07:21, 30 July 2008 (UTC) 3081:12:13, 23 July 2008 (UTC) 3054:11:34, 23 July 2008 (UTC) 3044:. What was her name? -- 3029:16:37, 20 July 2008 (UTC) 3010:08:12, 20 July 2008 (UTC) 2993:08:00, 20 July 2008 (UTC) 2761:12:25, 22 June 2007 (UTC) 2404:17:32, 13 July 2007 (UTC) 2370:03:43, 2 June 2007 (UTC) 2326:14:21, 20 July 2015 (UTC) 2034:16:48, 19 July 2008 (UTC) 1917:20:39, 16 June 2006 (UTC) 1862:I found an article about 1668:02:02, 9 April 2006 (UTC) 1635:, functioned as a strong 1589:12:50, 2 April 2006 (UTC) 1548:00:28, 2 April 2006 (UTC) 1134:02:23, 23 July 2008 (UTC) 957:13:46, 13 July 2016 (UTC) 884: 864: 842: 800:dedicated to coverage of 762: 715: 699: 683: 658: 654: 572: 551:military history articles 513: 466: 442: 418: 343: 311: 208:be bold, but not reckless 80:Be welcoming to newcomers 4620:13:52, 27 May 2019 (UTC) 4603:01:13, 20 May 2019 (UTC) 4436:13:47, 27 May 2019 (UTC) 4420:01:14, 20 May 2019 (UTC) 4311:17:19, 15 May 2014 (UTC) 4261:Michael VIII Palaiologos 3829:Please do not modify it. 3717:, but don't have to be. 3452:Please do not modify it. 3238:20:35, 13 May 2009 (UTC) 2978:03:32, 4 July 2008 (UTC) 2748:Degradation of Knowledge 2555:15:43, 22 May 2020 (UTC) 2390:04:40, 8 June 2007 (UTC) 2291:23:47, 13 May 2007 (UTC) 1885:16:33, 10 May 2006 (UTC) 972:16:10, 11 May 2022 (UTC) 4878:C-Class Russia articles 4838:Core biography articles 4496:External links modified 4224:Leo II, King of Armenia 3911:Catherine move proposed 3529:Alexander the Liberator 3313:"Medieval nation state" 1871:20:37, 9 May 2006 (UTC) 1644:Ivan and Andrey Shuisky 1181:There is an article on 1118:born on 18 Jan, 1993. 813:, or contribute to the 659:Associated task forces: 604:Coverage and accuracy: 4768:C-Class vital articles 4269:Michael IX Palaiologos 4216:Leo I, King of Armenia 3992: 3917:Catherine II of Russia 3632:; "Ivan the Terrible" 3559:Catherine II of Russia 3525:Alexander II of Russia 2560:Epithet "The terrible" 1444:Very Primitive Article 1350:It's been over a month 881: 861: 712: 696: 680: 637:Supporting materials: 565: 463: 439: 415: 200:and content may be in 75:avoid personal attacks 4281:Manuel II Palaiologos 4240:Manuel II Palaiologos 3987: 3521:Alexander the Blessed 3517:Alexander I of Russia 3059:I think her name was 2677:by replacing it with 2249:comment was added by 2203:comment was added by 1996:, which has become a 1938:comment was added by 1737:St. Basil's Cathedral 1071:comment was added by 880: 860: 711: 695: 679: 564: 462: 438: 414: 374:WikiProject Biography 290:level-4 vital article 214:neutral point of view 100:Neutral point of view 4293:Vasili III of Russia 4252:Vasili III of Russia 2951:(1577), and finally 2949:Vassilisa Malentieva 1495:comment was added by 1404:comment was added by 1225:comment was added by 1183:Simeon Bekbulatovich 503:Russian & Soviet 333:Royalty and Nobility 105:No original research 4408:Ivan the Terrifying 4289:Sophia Palaiologina 4248:Sophia Palaiologina 3921:Catherine the Great 3630:gives 2,630 results 3601:Catherine the Great 3555:Catherine the Great 3217:1 photo, 2 captions 3159:From my talk page: 2922:Anastasia of Russia 2238:Conquest of Siberia 2021:"Ivan the Terrible" 1897:Talk:Jan I Olbracht 1166:Semen Bekbulatovich 1083:) 15 February 2007. 719:(c. 1500 – c. 1800) 626:Grammar and style: 579:for B-class status: 4572:InternetArchiveBot 4460:Assessment comment 4285:Thomas Palaiologos 4277:John V Palaiologos 4244:Thomas Palaiologos 4236:John V Palaiologos 3942:Unit of Conversion 3696:, which says that 3069:Kabardino-Balkaria 2945:Anna Vasilshchikov 2933:Maria Cherkasskaya 2354:thaNKS FOR UR HELP 1982:in popular culture 1902:John IV of Muscovy 1745:English Knowledge. 1114:Ivan IV certainly 1057:From the article: 882: 862: 815:project discussion 793:WikiProject Russia 713: 697: 681: 566: 533:list of open tasks 464: 440: 416: 401:biography articles 299:content assessment 86:dispute resolution 47: 4695: 4683:comment added by 4610:common usage?" -- 4505:Ivan the Terrible 4490: 4489: 4388: 4376:comment added by 4367: 4355:comment added by 4322:original research 4297:Ivan the Terrible 4256:Ivan the Terrible 4202: 4153:Materialscientist 4131:Ivan the Terrible 4100:comment added by 4081:Materialscientist 3885:Ivan the Terrible 3839:Ivan the Terrible 3807:Ivan the Terrible 3481:Ivan the Terrible 3477:Ivan IV of Russia 3470: 3382: 3370:comment added by 3357: 3345:comment added by 3332:Ivan the Terrible 3255:comment added by 3228:comment added by 2582: 2570:comment added by 2520: 2508:comment added by 2262: 2220: 2169: 2157:comment added by 1951: 1724: 1707:comment added by 1509: 1418: 1239: 1150:comment added by 1136: 1124:comment added by 1084: 1028: 1016:comment added by 903: 902: 899: 898: 895: 894: 731: 730: 727: 726: 723: 722: 650: 649: 595:criterion not met 537:full instructions 481: 480: 477: 476: 268: 267: 226: 225: 183: 182: 66:Assume good faith 43: 25:Ivan the Terrible 4910: 4678: 4582: 4573: 4546: 4543: 4542: 4477: 4476: 4469: 4371: 4350: 4335: 4318:reliable sources 4200: 4112: 4040:Family and death 4025:Battle of Molodi 3889:William the Lion 3881:Robert the Bruce 3659:Alfred the Great 3561:since 2005... -- 3464: 3454: 3365: 3340: 3267: 3240: 3178: 3176: 3061:Maria Tscerkaski 2874:Questionable ref 2565: 2503: 2487: 2368: 2365: 2362: 2348: 2261:) 25 March 2007. 2244: 2198: 2152: 2051: 2010: 1990:featured article 1933: 1925:Quality, Sources 1908: 1880: 1754: 1751: 1723: 1701: 1488: 1397: 1218: 1162: 1119: 1066: 1011: 930: 831: 830: 827: 824: 821: 787: 782: 781: 780: 771: 764: 763: 758: 755: 740: 733: 732: 666: 656: 655: 640: 636: 635: 629: 625: 624: 618: 614: 613: 607: 603: 602: 596: 592: 591: 570: 569: 553: 552: 549: 546: 543: 542:Military history 522: 515: 514: 509: 494:Military history 490: 483: 482: 470:core biographies 403: 402: 399: 396: 393: 379:join the project 368: 366:Biography portal 363: 362: 361: 352: 345: 344: 339: 320: 313: 312: 296: 287: 286: 279: 278: 270: 262:January 16, 2011 258:January 16, 2007 254:January 16, 2006 250:January 16, 2005 235: 228: 192: 191: 185: 179: 178: 164: 95:Article policies 16: 4918: 4917: 4913: 4912: 4911: 4909: 4908: 4907: 4733: 4732: 4717: 4675: 4646:Cinefan Cinefan 4628: 4591: 4576: 4571: 4544: 4540: 4513:this simple FaQ 4498: 4465: 4462: 4357:109.182.239.105 4346: 4333: 4228:Rita of Armenia 4213: 4133: 4095: 4061: 4045:Garret Beaumain 4017: 3997: 3972: 3944: 3913: 3835: 3692:But what about 3634:returns 106,000 3586:Peter the Great 3450: 3444: 3334: 3315: 3306: 3273: 3250: 3246: 3230:142.179.231.179 3223: 3219: 3174: 3172: 3157: 3132: 3110: 3039: 3037:Kabard princess 2941:Anna Koltoskaya 2924:as his wife. 2918: 2876: 2812: 2798: 2750: 2708:awe-inspiring. 2562: 2535: 2485: 2401:Garret Beaumain 2379: 2366: 2363: 2360: 2356: 2346: 2283: 2245:—The preceding 2240: 2199:—The preceding 2191: 2063: 2049: 2042: 2008: 1992:when I created 1978: 1957: 1950:) 22 June 2006. 1934:—The preceding 1927: 1906: 1893: 1878: 1860: 1832: 1782: 1752: 1749: 1733: 1702: 1633:Elena Glinskaya 1516: 1446: 1394: 1305:Muscovy Company 1262:Church Slavonic 1246: 1168: 1145: 1142: 1067:—The preceding 1055: 964:185.135.151.243 959: 939: 924: 915: 908: 906:Word Correction 829:Russia articles 828: 825: 822: 819: 818: 807:To participate: 783: 778: 776: 756: 746: 664: 638: 633: 627: 622: 616: 611: 605: 600: 594: 589: 550: 547: 544: 541: 540: 496: 400: 397: 394: 391: 390: 364: 359: 357: 326: 297:on Knowledge's 294: 284: 189: 121: 116: 115: 114: 91: 61: 12: 11: 5: 4916: 4906: 4905: 4900: 4895: 4890: 4885: 4880: 4875: 4870: 4865: 4860: 4855: 4850: 4845: 4840: 4835: 4830: 4825: 4820: 4815: 4810: 4805: 4800: 4795: 4790: 4785: 4780: 4775: 4770: 4765: 4760: 4755: 4750: 4745: 4721:81.108.244.153 4716: 4713: 4712: 4711: 4701:115.244.45.193 4674: 4671: 4627: 4626:Categorization 4624: 4623: 4622: 4590: 4587: 4566: 4565: 4558: 4534: 4533: 4525:Added archive 4523: 4497: 4494: 4488: 4487: 4461: 4458: 4457: 4456: 4442: 4441: 4440: 4439: 4438: 4345: 4342: 4341: 4340: 4337: 4212: 4209: 4208: 4207: 4180: 4179: 4178: 4177: 4167:SpecialAdviser 4138:SpecialAdviser 4132: 4129: 4102:213.87.136.201 4092: 4091: 4060: 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3324: 3320: 3310: 3304:Ivan Murdered 3301: 3300: 3296: 3292: 3291:149.152.191.3 3287: 3286: 3282: 3278: 3277:149.152.191.3 3268: 3266: 3262: 3258: 3254: 3241: 3239: 3235: 3231: 3227: 3214: 3213: 3209: 3205: 3204:Alex Bakharev 3201: 3193: 3189: 3185: 3184: 3181: 3177: 3169: 3166: 3162: 3161: 3160: 3152: 3151: 3147: 3143: 3139: 3136: 3127: 3124: 3123: 3119: 3115: 3101: 3097: 3093: 3088: 3087: 3086: 3085: 3082: 3078: 3074: 3070: 3066: 3062: 3058: 3057: 3056: 3055: 3051: 3047: 3043: 3030: 3026: 3022: 3017: 3016: 3015: 3014: 3011: 3007: 3003: 2998: 2997: 2994: 2990: 2986: 2982: 2981: 2980: 2979: 2975: 2971: 2966: 2964: 2958: 2957: 2954: 2950: 2946: 2942: 2938: 2934: 2929: 2925: 2923: 2911: 2907: 2903: 2902:Alex Bakharev 2899: 2895: 2894: 2893: 2892: 2888: 2884: 2880: 2871: 2864: 2860: 2856: 2851: 2850: 2849: 2848: 2843: 2839: 2835: 2831: 2830: 2829: 2828: 2827: 2826: 2822: 2818: 2807: 2806: 2803: 2793: 2792: 2788: 2784: 2777: 2773: 2769: 2768:38.136.14.239 2765: 2764: 2763: 2762: 2759: 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