1930:. I'm guess I'm just tired of well written, interesting articles based on historical figures getting deleted based on the whims of a few. The real reason is that this thing got a bit popular, so it caught the attention of some elitist, minimalist editors. I find it funny that in the discussion "Merge", though it was such a close margin (3 to 2 in favor of merging the characters), it got merged. Is this allowed? I'm no hardcore Wikipedian so I'm not really sure if that was allowed; if I was aware of this merge, I would have been against it. Whatever, I'm going off on a digression.
1639:), etc. Overuse of these stock excuses to delete articles, frequently applied with complete disregard to the article's merits and backed with half-assed (if any) justifications commonly delving into circular logic, non-sequiturs, or mere assertions, slowly became refined over the course of the english wikipedia and turned some of these excuses into official guidelines for articles, which now means that even a democratic consensus to keep is generally not enough to block deletion, etc. in stark violation of
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is a foregone conclusion regardless of how an enemy dodges. Essentially, it works by twisting fate. The bouncing effect was actually the spear curving at an impossible angle to hit. The thing is that it was a very long piece in the VN itself and as such I thought it might be a bit too much infodumping to explain it there. Nevertheless, it does not bounce, so I removed that part. If someone can explain Gae Bolg in a way that doesn't TL;DR people to death, they should put it in. :p
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that also has historical counterpart are much more NOTABLE then popular series characters like BLEACH or Dragon Ball. I mean, BLEACH has more then ten character specific articles on completely fictional stuff, while many of the articles in Fate/Stay Night refer to historical topic in other section of the
Knowledge. Just because Fate/Stay Night isn't as popular doesn't mean that it hold no scholastic value on how popular culture view historical figures. Right?
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enough people), so it should get deleted in spite of the minority that does care, along with generic references to concern about server space, assertions that it's "unencyclopedic," vague claims of POV, claims of fancruft, claims that it's insignificant, assertions that it should belong somewhere else and therefore not on wikipedia (which is in fact a
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The actual explanation for how Gae Bolg works is rather long and unwieldy, so I wasn't sure if I should put it in. It works by reversing cause and effect, so basically, it will be thrown because it has already pierced its target, and not the other way round, meaning the fact that it pierces the enemy
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Hopefully we can, or else I'm going to have to bring this up to some people in high places (since I don't really know how to undo a merge myself). The worst part is, it seems that someone deleted the edit summaries and history when merging it; so, even if someone did revert the merge, the information
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Can we reopen this for discussion? I understand that the previous character articles did not do enough to justify notability, but this does not mean that they weren't notable. Someone just needs to write a reception section and such. For those of you who think the characters are not notable, consider
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Sakura is the main antagonist of the Heaven's Feel route, which is the true canonical route of Fate/Stay Night and the ending that leads to Hollow
Ataraxia. She is as entitled to being a main character as any other characters. There are far better things to moderate with your stupid on Knowledge than
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These servants really aren't main characters at all, and Shinji was only important in one arc of the story. Sakura Matō is a bit iffy as well, since she didn't have much of a role until fairly late, and it was more related to the second-last arc in the story. If there's no disagreement, I will drop
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The person who made the previous edits apparently doesn't know of the VN's existence, tagging some things as 'in the anime' (when they also occur in the VN), not clarifying which parts are anime-original, and some gross factual inaccuracies (like stating that Shirou traces
Excalibur in Fate against
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It seems to me if someone actually looks up the sources that are clearly there, anyone could "unmerge" them as long as they added enough justifying info such as a per-character reception section. These characters ARE notable and anyone who wants to spend the time gather the evidence has a huge case
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I would just like to add that this is yet another section of wiki that has fallen victim to 'notability' deletions. I remember reading the excellent articles several months back while watching, and I wanted a refresher on the stuff but some douche bangs apparently didn't want me and a lot of people
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Welcome to current day
Knowledge. Notability guidelines originally weren't guidelines and in fact began more or less as an excuse to delete articles people didn't like where it was used to claim that not enough people care about the article (usually applied with no threshold for what would count as
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IMO leave the articles as-is. The statistics and the weapon summies need to stay, because they are the key parts of the articles. If we all compressed it into one list, people would whine it's too big. If we remove that stuff, people will whine it's incomplete. If we dumb it down, people will whine
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It's far less convenient to everyone if we move all these articles to Wikia. Having a large amount of information in a single site is much better than telling people to go to another, ad-supported site that isn't even on most people's
Favorites lists. And if the character bios don't meet notability
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I agree that there is this great concern regarding articles being deleted on various anime,menga related artiles, and it seems like there is also some unfairness between series that's already translated and released in
America and series that's not. Personally, I think fictional characters in Fate
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Nope, I haven't played the visual novel. Thanks for fixing the oversight of
Caliburn/Excalibur. As for Rider's NP, she doesn't reveal that Bell name until she fights Saber so blame the English dub for not making that clear. Gae Bolg does appear to reflect/bounce off the ground in the anime, so if
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Merchandise is noteworthy as well. *LOTS* of figures. Saber has an especially wide array of figures. This extends way past any 1 media. Plushies and other memorabilia are on par with other mainstream anime franchises. Additionally, there are many fan projects, including the completed
Original FSN
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The article gets somehow confusing. Archer is revealed to be the future Shiro only in the
Unlimited Blade Works route, while in the Fate one (if I correctly remember) he does not even use the Trace skill, and simply remains as an unnamed blacksmith from some english-speaking country. It should be
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either and assume that it is always proper to delete anything if a guideline would approve of it, so nowadays there quickly exists automatic consensus to delete anything. This issue is commonly exacerbated by frequently inviting people who have no relation, experience, or knowledge whatsoever in
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Blah blah blah lack of notability, original research, extraneous plot summary. Everything listed in the Fate/Stay Night wiki is STRAIGHT OUT OF THE GAME. There is no 'original research'. Find me examples of original research and we'll talk. Extraneous plot summaries? Okay, yeah, that I can sorta
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Although this isn't really related to the discussion, is Jimmy Wale's statement, "Imagine a world in which every single person on the planet is given free access to the sum of all human knowledge. That's what we're doing." basically a lie? All these merges and things that happen in
Knowledge and
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No offense to BLEACH fans or anyone specific, but we must understand here that the overall guideline on Anime related section are quite vague. A lot of topic that is NOT NOTICEABLE to English speaking country doesn't means that it's not noticeable in other parts of the world. Type-Moon work is
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You ever heard of the expression IF IT AIN'T BROKE DON'T FIX IT? Yeah, this applies here. Seriously, what's wrong with the articles? Are they hurting anyone? Look at the size of the talk pages of most of them. They need to stay, and idiots need to stop tearing down articles for the fun of it.
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Aside from the wide array presented here which shows that CLEARLY each of the main characters extends beyond the anime or visual novel, the reception is extremely positive as well. I think no one was paying attention when this "merge" was decided on. Please tell me we can reevaluate this.
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to read it. It apparently is only notable if some elitist wiki editing group knows about it. Anyone know where we can all at least see the older versions? Vague excuses like it taking up too much disk space on the server is a joke. It MIGHT have been relevant 10 years ago, but not now.
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There's a lot of original research introduced into this article. Not only is none of it cited, some of it is factually inaccurate, or seemingly based off personal interpretations of the text. Please help by citing any overly wordy explanations, or by removing dubious stuff.
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agree on-- some characters do have a bit of extra summaries that aren't NECESSARY. However, everything in the articles is spot-on to the series and like someone above me mentioned, it all links to things found in the real world(tm) that are also vital to the characters.
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I've moved Shinji, Berserker, and Rider to Supporting Characters. Archer stays in main as they even devote a final closing credits at the anime series's halfway point to his defeat, and if he's Shirou in one of the story arcs, that sounds like a main character.
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Considering how Illya, Kiritsugu and Sakura might move more coverage thanks to the new Fate series focused on them it might be possible to give them character articles. Kiritsugu in particular has a lot of creation information if you check type moon
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2. The direction of the main article of FSN seems to concentrate on anime version which focuses on Fate arc.I believe the article(the main one) should give equal importance to the other arcs because FSN was originally a visual novel, not a anime.
1922:), and an anime. Saber even has a figurine modeled after her, along with keychains and the like. Fate/stay night characters also show up in games like MUGEN; people make desktop wallpapers for these characters. What's NOT notable are articles like
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regard to the article or its subject matter and so are generally more than happy to help implement policy because they completely lack any and all perspective whatsoever on why these articles should be preserved in spite of the guidelines.
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Alright, I read the debate on the proposals of deletion for some Fate/Stay Night characters and also read that they were going to be merged. In short, are they going to be reduced to little meaningless character descriptions as seen in
2228:. While the two are different series, there is quite overlapping with the same characters like Saber, Kotomine, among others especially since Kiritsugu was given an article. Please share your comments to reach a consensus.
1796:, remain status quo: These four are the main characters of the visual novel. Knowing character in detail is part of enjoying the visual novel. I believe wikipedia should retain the separate articles for these characters
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I know it's because of UBW but Sakura doesn't do much in that route either. I have had a discussion on a forum and we ended up saying that Illya was a main character rather than supporting. Does she qualify?
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Hope I can add this here since he's a Fate character as well. Is it possible that we can make a page for Waver since he's also a character that makes multiple appearances in the Fate universe?
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the character list is pretty small and can be merged back. Personally, i would suggest having sections be divided into "Introduced in Fate/Stay night" and "Introduced in Fate Zero"
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Yes, because notability is an excuse to be a stupid douche and want to delete everything when Knowledge's purpose is to be as complete as possible about every subject possible.
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However, I think we should discuss if my move is correct or not. If no one reply within a month, I will proceed in creating a separate article for Sakura Matō.
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Oh goodness, it seems Wikia doesn't even have a Fate/stay Night article but only one on TYPE-MOON; is there any other database that has everything in existence?
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holding great influences within the Dojinshi market right now, and that's a BIG influence. Is that not Noticeable in terms of the anime/menga industry in Japan?
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No, Knowledge's purpose is to be an encyclopedia and cover subjects of note, not everything in existence. If you want everything in existence, go to Wikia. —
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with only a few exceptions? Honestly, the info regarding the weapons' legends in the Gilgamesh article (and others that are going to be merged, such as the
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outside of the game or anime series. Characters need to have independently notable from whatever work they are from by receiving significant coverage by
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Knowledge is everything by everyone for everyone. It's the most complete encyclopedia about absolutely everything ever. Leave it alone and let it grow.
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http://www.toyslogic.com/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&zenid=251fbn4t0s0o80g1pbleoauh23&keyword=saber
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Waver doesn't appear in the visual novel. His only inclusion so far was the last episode of Ufotable's Unlimited Blade Works. He is present in
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What was that about not being notable? Also, if you're going to be extreme and say something like a character needing a movie to be notable....
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visual novel complete English translation by Mirror Moon(including voice patch) and NDS port for visual novel(including voice patch).
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I only thought about merging the two works directly connected but I'm not sure about the others since I haven't watched the others.
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Why do the characters no longer have their own pages and get linked to the character list page? I don't know. Maybe someone does.
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for both the merge and having a List of Fate characters. But will the Grand Order characters will be merged here as well or not?
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These four do not currently assert notability. If nobody can add creation and reception information, they should be merged.
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1778:, merge: in the absence of real world information, these descriptions are better presented in a proper character list.
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for this. Each character is in SEVERAL games now, and there are dozens if not hundreds of character figures for them.
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3. The details of Heaven's feel was a lot and messy and was hard to draw any information of Sakura Matō from it.
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The moral of the story is that you should give up and wikipedia deletion policies are pretty much beyond help now.
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I thought "List of Fate characters" but that would be the entire franchise like what happened to the .hack list.
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http://ocha.nierchi.net/2009/09/28/good-smile-company-fate-unlimited-codes-%E2%80%93-saber-lily-distant-avalon/
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characters, I thought I would ask here in advance. Hope that was okay, since no one answered in the
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non-policy). Most of the editors nowadays who blindly implement these policies have never heard of
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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http://www.yesasia.com/us/nendoroid-fate-unlimited-codes-saber-lily/1020431888-0-0-0-en/info.html
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1999:@ sifsclub: It was probably that tnt guy that deleted the page. He's the delete-happy one here.
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article) linked me to other interesting things, such as the origins behind the names and how "
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and make it like other Fate characters who have sections dedicated to real world information.
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As for reliable sources, do we need a section on reception for the characters (example, like
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guidelines, why isn't the entire Fate series just one line in a list of Visual Novels page?
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the above from main characters to secondary (I'll leave Sakura there for the time being). --
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Not notable? Hardly. These characters show up in a video game, visual NOVEL (not game : -->
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I guess it is useless to discuss after all; you have decided the answer from the beginning
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I'm not experienced with Grand Order so I think somebody else might need to work in that.
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All inaccuracies and errors should be fixed now, along with several grammatical errors.
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linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check
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2030:· Original PC Visual Novel (Exceptionally popular in Japan, now accessible in English)
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2414:. If you are interested in giving him an article, remember to follow the guidelines
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when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an
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I would like to propose an idea to reintroduce an article that contains details of
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I'd change it; as to what, I'm unsure of right now, but I'd definitely change it.
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After doing clean up of detailed fictional information I've been wondering if the
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late reply I know, still, Archer traced his twin swords in all his appearance.
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I see. However, I wonder if the title of the page should be changed though.
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1. Sakura was the antagonist of one arcs in Fate Stay Night, Heaven's feel
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Berserker, Rider's NP is 'Pegasus', Gae Bolg works by bouncing... LOL?).
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don't get articles. And a lot of the stuff in the character articles is
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Though if they can be improved with real-world content, restore 'em.--
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Yes, I know but since you're planning to do the merging of the
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http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=10981
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That this article is linked to from the image description page.
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I believe that several of the characters currently listed as
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on the image's description page for the use in this article.
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I think you can also add the spin off characters as well.
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wouldn't be there (at least that's what it seems to me).
1926:. Don't go all technical on me; I'm somewhat aware of
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1321:Image copyright problem with Image:Emiya Saber.jpg
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1972:Not notable? Excuse me while I laugh my ass off.
2042:· Light Novels (Fate/Zero) prequel (4 volumes)
1864:"Fate/stay night character redirects to lists"
1384:. For assistance on the image use policy, see
2542:Low-importance video game characters articles
1395:Moving some characters from main to secondary
1360:The following images also have this problem:
2448:characters talk page. And I will :) Thanks!
806:Lego Indiana Jones: The Original Adventures
1707:Reintroduce article details on Sakura Matō
1253:Knowledge:WikiProject Fictional characters
2577:WikiProject Fictional characters articles
2547:Video game characters task force articles
1329:is used in this article under a claim of
1256:Template:WikiProject Fictional characters
2252:for the reason (and suggestion) above ^
2562:Low-importance anime and manga articles
2040:· Fate/Hollow Ataraxia PC Visual Novel
1904:that are independent of the subject. --
740:Pokémon Sword and Shield Expansion Pass
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2537:C-Class video game characters articles
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2567:All WikiProject Anime and manga pages
2527:C-Class visual novel-related articles
1167:Knowledge:WikiProject Anime and manga
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2572:C-Class fictional character articles
2112:there's a better word, throw it in.
2038:· PSP - Fate/Extra (in development)
1233:This article is within the scope of
1170:Template:WikiProject Anime and manga
1143:This article is within the scope of
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555:Five Nights at Freddy's: Help Wanted
190:the Video game characters task force
105:This article is within the scope of
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2412:The Case Files of Lord El-Melloi II
1977:http://www.hlj.com/product/ENT01389
1386:Knowledge:Media copyright questions
38:It is of interest to the following
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2522:Low-importance video game articles
2226:List of Fate/stay night characters
2086:Fixed tons of factual inaccuracies
1687:I wonder what should be done now?
1486:List of Fate/stay night characters
940:The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask
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2034:· PS2+PSP - Fate Unlimited Codes
125:Knowledge:WikiProject Video games
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2026:· Movie slated for January 2010
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1380:This is an automated notice by
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2278:22:40, 11 September 2020 (UTC)
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2022:Here is a list of Fate media:
1967:01:46, 12 September 2009 (UTC)
1702:You cant do anything about it.
1315:17:25, 18 September 2021 (UTC)
964:Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare
1:
2211:02:54, 23 February 2019 (UTC)
2078:22:47, 18 December 2009 (UTC)
2036:· PSP - Fate/Tiger Colosseum
2028:· manga (9 volumes, ongoing)
2024:· 26 episode anime TV series
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1584:09:04, 16 February 2009 (UTC)
1471:16:54, 28 February 2012 (UTC)
1452:23:31, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
1390:11:47, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
1247:and see a list of open tasks.
1161:and see a list of open tasks.
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507:List of generation IX Pokémon
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187:This article is supported by
167:This article is supported by
119:and see a list of open tasks.
2408:List of Fate/Zero characters
2222:List of Fate/Zero characters
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2170:23:04, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
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1608:it's not informative enough.
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1536:08:32, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
1515:Stuff that doesn't meet our
1510:06:43, 10 January 2009 (UTC)
1436:01:20, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
1335:requirements for such images
1259:fictional character articles
495:Featured content candidates
170:the visual novels task force
7:
2517:C-Class video game articles
2502:22:23, 7 October 2020 (UTC)
2480:22:00, 7 October 2020 (UTC)
2458:21:41, 7 October 2020 (UTC)
2428:21:24, 7 October 2020 (UTC)
2395:21:12, 7 October 2020 (UTC)
2371:11:11, 1 January 2022 (UTC)
2353:16:06, 7 October 2020 (UTC)
2339:20:17, 4 October 2020 (UTC)
2176:Plenty of original research
2009:07:33, 4 October 2009 (UTC)
1859:10:57, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
1146:WikiProject Anime and manga
924:No did you know nominations
10:
2593:
2032:· PS2 - Realta Nua (port)
1844:18:54, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
1697:01:34, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
1299:14:45, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
1193:project's importance scale
928:Reviews and reassessments
151:project's importance scale
2357:Given this, switching to
2149:Illya's a side character?
2141:05:58, 3 April 2012 (UTC)
2122:05:47, 3 April 2012 (UTC)
2106:04:55, 3 April 2012 (UTC)
1825:17:08, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
1806:04:52, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
1787:05:42, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
1765:01:34, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
1746:09:22, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
1221:
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567:Good article nominations
487:
273:
218:
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186:
166:
144:
77:
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2196:Potential new characters
1643:(which has now become a
1173:anime and manga articles
900:Mario Party: Island Tour
768:The King of Fighters '99
678:Pokémon Sword and Shield
592:Puff-puff (onomatopoeia)
519:Mario Party: The Top 100
1525:extraneous plot summary
1490:Rider (Fate/stay night)
976:A Space for the Unbound
858:The Great Giana Sisters
476:Minecraft – Volume Beta
307:List of Tiger handhelds
223:Video games WikiProject
208:Video games WikiProject
108:WikiProject Video games
2224:should be merged with
1928:WP: Other stuff exists
1365:Image:Shinji Rider.JPG
1349:non-free use rationale
1278:About Archer and Shiro
1138:Anime and manga portal
1063:translation from japan
792:Fan-made Pokémon games
398:SuperBot Entertainment
183:
163:
28:This article is rated
1815:Same reason as above.
1327:Image:Emiya Saber.jpg
1283:rewritten, I think.
1007:Articles that need...
182:
162:
1517:notability guideline
1370:Image:Rin Archer.jpg
1250:Fictional characters
1241:fictional characters
1216:Fictional characters
630:Shin Megami Tensei V
492:No major discussions
2014:Undoing the "Merge"
1734:Regards nipaa1412
131:video game articles
1896:Because they were
716:Yoshi's New Island
184:
164:
100:Video games portal
34:content assessment
2172:
2160:comment added by
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450:Merge discussions
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2359:being merged
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2156:— Preceding
2152:
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1924:Pottersville
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1637:non sequitur
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1285:— Preceding
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1027:reassessment
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688:Pixel Piracy
667:
664:Miner 2049er
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437:participants
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418:participants
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411:Ryo Sakazaki
405:participants
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40:WikiProjects
2019:this list:
1898:not notable
1871:—Preceding
1836:Kung Fu Man
1817:85.139.80.3
1713:Sakura Matō
1576:66.91.59.58
1570:—Preceding
1494:Enuma Elish
1432:Fuko Master
1407:Shinji Matō
1339:explanation
1051:screenshots
754:Async Corp.
578:Donkey Kong
456:Screen Rant
340:participant
301:participant
288:participant
221:Summary of
210:open tasks:
206:Summary of
122:Video games
113:video games
59:Video games
2511:Categories
2216:Merge 2020
1738:60.50.9.44
1658:24.7.96.89
1382:FairuseBot
1325:The image
1013:assessment
844:River Raid
531:The Sims 4
480:discussion
470:discussion
460:discussion
346:Butterfree
225:open tasks
68:Characters
2446:Fate/Zero
2114:AngusWOOF
2052:AllUltima
2001:Hell Pyro
1936:AllUltima
1798:Nipaa1412
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2158:unsigned
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